Since it premiered in 2009, “RuPaul’s Drag Race” has steadily grown to become one of the most popular reality competition shows on television. It has won a total of 29 Primetime Emmys and spawned multiple spin-offs, including the ever-popular “RuPaul’s Drag Race All Stars,” which just completed its 10th season, and numerous international competitions. For its 17th season, “RuPaul’s Drag Race” recently earned eight Emmy nominations, including for Outstanding Makeup for a Variety, Nonfiction or Reality Program. Previous Emmy winners Natasha Marcelina and former contestant Raven are two of the show’s nominees in this category, and they were kind enough to chat with us about their most recent nominations, how the show changed their lives, and what working on such an unapologetically queer program means to them. Please listen to or read the transcribed interview below, and be sure to check out “RuPaul’s Drag Race,” which is now available to stream on various streaming services and is up for your consideration for this year’s Emmys. Enjoy!
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Hello, this is Cody Dericks with Next Best Picture, and I am so excited to be speaking today with recent Emmy nominees for Outstanding Makeup for a Variety, Nonfiction or Reality Program for “RuPaul’s Drag Race.” I’m here with Natasha Marcelina and Raven! Thank you so much for joining me today, both of you.
RAVEN: Hi Cody. Thanks for having us.
NATASHA: Hello.
Alright, I’m going to jump right in with a question for both of you. For those who may not know, can you tell me about your role on “RuPaul’s Drag Race?” Natasha, I’m going to start with you.
NATASHA: So, I am overseeing the makeup department for judges, guest judges, celebrity guests, pit crew, dancers, models, basically any guests that we have on the show.
All right. And Raven, how about you? Same kind of situation?
RAVEN: She does it all. No, I am strictly in charge of [RuPaul]. I help get Ru in complete almost everything. I mean, there’s a lot that he does for himself, but I help get him camera-ready. And then, of course, there are times when I am also in front of the camera, so I do that myself. I don’t, you know, really care to have anyone else do it, although our team is one of the best, and I would feel in good hands if they did do it! But that’s about it. There have been times when I’ve helped out with other things, but it’s mainly just Ru.
Alright, Raven, I’m going to jump right back to you because I want to know what it was like going from being a competitor on the show in Season Two [and] All Stars One to working on the show?
RAVEN: Well, you know, I’ve always been a fan of the show. I’ve always been a fan of Ru, I’ve always been a fan. When I got called and I found out that I was cast on the show, I was just completely excited. And when I left, I thought, what an amazing opportunity I’ve just been given, my life is going to change. So, several years later, when I got the call to step in and do this, it was a different nod of approval, if that makes any sense. It was like, no, now I need you to come back here and do this for me. And I remember where I was, I remember everything. And I remember just crying and thinking, “I’m not going to be able to do this.”
And I remember showing up the next day, and I, well, I remember Natasha actually texting me that night, and she goes, “Don’t worry, we have everything you’re going to need. You can bring what you want.” So, Natasha was like my emotional support. Where it just, we all kind of…it worked well. And it was kind of like a, what’s the word? It was synergy. We all got together and just made it work. You know, because my nerves and my anxiety and my everything got…I got in my head. I do not, and still do not, feel that I did my best work. And I still don’t feel like I do, I still feel like I’m constantly evolving. But even for my drag, where it’s…I always feel like I could do better. I bawled my eyes out.
Well, Emmy voters like what you’re doing.
RAVEN: And I still love Ru, and I still love [the production company] World of Wonder, even being back and seeing how, you know, the sauce is made. I love them even more because I see what is put into it and how much work it takes to do this.
Amazing. Natasha, so this is your fifth nomination for “Drag Race.” You also won previously, along with Raven. Congratulations. But you were also previously nominated for “American Horror Stories.” Can you tell me about the biggest differences, if any, or any surprising similarities between working on narrative and reality shows?
NATASHA: I mean, I think that’s the biggest difference right there is that a show like “American Horror Stories” is scripted. And a show like “RuPaul’s Drag Race” is a reality show, a reality competition show. So, the vibe is different. The way that the department operates is completely different. The way that we maintain looks and, you know, basically document what we’re doing is also different. It’s a lot more spontaneous working on a reality show versus doing a scripted series. But I think that in terms of similarities, I mean, you have someone like Ryan Murphy who is sort of like in…I feel like in the same world kind of as “Drag Race,” and you see that he incorporates a lot of the same types of characters that we have on our show as actual personalities that [he] and his team have written into their shows, which has always made me a big fan of his.
RAVEN: They’re both horror stories!
NATASHA: [laughs] Yeah!
So, the fabulousness and homosexual interest carry across both shows is what you’re saying, essentially.
NATASHA: Absolutely. Absolutely, yeah.
Now, Raven, as just a makeup artist in general, I’d love to know, if you can specify, pull them apart: what came first – your passion for drag, your passion for makeup, or did they kind of grow together?
RAVEN: I will say my passion for makeup happened first because I was playing with makeup at a very young age. I guess you would say I was putting myself into drag when I was doing it, but I always had a passion for makeup. So, as I got older, and at the time when I was growing up, the only guys who wore makeup were drag queens, or they were, you know, rock stars. There weren’t really guys who did makeup. So, as I got a little bit older, I said I really want to get into this more. And I remember seeing “To Wong Foo [Thanks for Everything! Julie Newmar]” and when I left – of course I didn’t want to drive cross country in a convertible in full drag – but I was like, “That’s what I want to do! I wanna do drag. That just looks so glamorous and so fun. Who wouldn’t want to do this?” And of course, at the time, I also saw RuPaul happening. I think I was 14 when I first saw him. I remember going, “Oh my God, that’s so beautiful. That’s a man?” Because most of the drag that we had been exposed to at the time was more of like a “we’re in on the joke,” and it wasn’t, you know, the glamour drag, it was more camp. And I wanted to be more glamour. Now, there’s camp always in drag, but I slowly transitioned my love for makeup into starting to do my own.
Amazing.
RAVEN: I have a tendency to rant. I’m sorry.
No, there’s no such thing as too much information here! Don’t worry.
RAVEN: Okay.
And Natasha, what got you into makeup, and what about it really inspires you?
NATASHA: Well, I think both Raven and I were MAC girls back in the day. Working at the MAC counter, doing the cosmetics in the retail department store. So, it’s a whole different world, but it wasn’t planned for me. I kind of fell into it more than anything. And then I just met a lot of really awesome people along the way who were super supportive of me and kind of blossomed into what it was…what it is today, you know, and I’m really grateful for that. But you know, I have an art background. I went to CalArts. I have a photography, mixed media installation background. And I started doing makeup for my photo shoots just out of necessity. And then it just became a thing.
So what’s scarier: customer service or intimidating drag queens?
NATASHA & RAVEN: Customer service.
That’s the correct answer, yep.
RAVEN: 100%. I still have PTSD. I still have nightmares about working in retail, only for certain, you know, not all of it, but it’s…it can be pretty gruesome, and I can only imagine what it’s like now.
NATASHA: Oh yeah.
I got out of those trenches. Thank God.
RAVEN: Good for you.
So this is neither of your first nominations for the show, but I imagine it does not stop getting exciting, getting recognized. So I’d love to know what your reaction was to being nominated this year. Raven, let’s start with you.
RAVEN: Anytime that you hear, “Oh! You got a nomination!” You are like, uh, are you kidding? I don’t ever expect it. And when I started doing this, that wasn’t the goal. It was just go in, do your job, make it look good. Put your heart and soul, and integrity into your job. And then I afterward realized, oh wait, there are awards you could win for this. At the end of the day, you just want to make sure you’re keeping your job and you’re continuing to work. But to be nominated is…you know, and I remember the morning we found out we were, it was a drag day, and Ru went to go check the list and was going through and going, “Oh my gosh, this department got nominated,” you know, “He got nominated. She got nominated,” and [he] said, “Oh, you guys got a nomination.” It was like, “We did?!” And I never feel like, “Of course we did.” I always feel like, “Wow, we are very fortunate.” It still is…I pinch myself to even think that this would be something that I would do, let alone with the amazing team that I do.
Maybe this is a leading question, but what would it mean to you to win again, if that were to happen?
RAVEN: It would mean that I would have to clear off a spot on my bookcase to put another beautiful statue. And it would also mean that, you know, you are always known as an Emmy winner once you win one, whether you have one or you have 15, you’re still an Emmy winner. But it would be great to have two. It would be great to say, “Wow, we won twice! We won two times. Two times we were recognized by our peers, by the Academy, for being the best at what we do.” So it would still feel just as amazing as it did the first time.
So, she needs a sister, you’re saying?
RAVEN: Yes. Earrings! I could use a set of earrings.
Natasha, same question, what was it like getting nominated, and what would it mean to possibly win again?
NATASHA: It was a huge surprise, a very huge surprise. I was like, wait, let me confirm this because one of our producers group texted us before I was in, and said, “Congratulations.” And I was like, okay, we’re doing this, you know, super exciting. The interesting thing about winning previously is that we won during COVID, so we actually won online. So we didn’t quite get the experience of, you know, going up on stage and accepting an award. And that’s a very unique experience in itself. But to be able to win on stage would be amazing. You know, two arms, two legs, two eyes, two titties, two Emmys! You know?
RAVEN: Two, two, and two! You know, I think that also going along with the fact that we won during COVID was, they made each person from the department go in…only one of us go in and film an acceptance speech because of the COVID restrictions. So they were like, “Hey, we need you to go in.” So they made me do it…not made me, but they asked me to do it, and I didn’t get to go up there with Natasha, Jen [Fregozo], and Nicole [Faulkner]. It’s not that it sucked, it was just like, oh, it would’ve been nice to be able to do this together.
Of course, yeah. Alright, I wanna close out with a question just to put a kind of a cap on things. With the state of the world today – whatever that means to you, but it means a lot, obviously – what does working on such an unapologetically, proudly queer show mean to you? Natasha, let’s start with you.
NATASHA: I mean, it means the world to me, honestly. Like, I couldn’t be more grateful to be involved in a show like this at this time. Unfortunately, or fortunately, I’m someone who watches the news every day, probably more than I should. So, you know, one of my biggest fears as we progress into what this is, is censorship. But I think that no matter how hard they try, they cannot censor this. This is always going to exist, whether it’s on TV, whether it’s in the club, or whether it’s underground. Like, you cannot get rid of us. You cannot get rid of this. And I think that there’s always going to be people fighting. I’m willing to fight for this, and I’m just very, very, very proud to be a part of this.
Raven, how about you?
RAVEN: I mean, Natasha summed it up, but I would’ve never guessed in a million years that “Drag Race” would have become what it has. From “RuPaul’s Drag Race” to “Drag Race” franchises around the world to where drag is now being looked at and celebrated. There are times when people are, you know, tearing it apart, and even from within the actual community, but to look at where drag has come…It’s been put in people’s homes around the world to watch and celebrate. You can’t take that away. You’ll never be able to take that away. And you know, there’s a lot of stuff that goes on. I don’t watch the news. I try not to. I am someone who worries too much, and I feel like, let me just pretend a lot of these things don’t exist, which I know they do, but I don’t…I feel that this is a mainstay, and it’s going to be something that will be remembered. It’s gonna continue to go on whether it’s actually filmed or not. Let’s hope that it continues to be, but it’s going to live forever. This will live on forever. This is an amazing moment in time to see drag being looked at in a respectful light.
NATASHA: People want to watch. People are interested and inspired, and that makes it so much of a more significant thing. They can try to stop us, but it’s only one small, tiny group of you know, small-minded people who want to stop. But the majority of people actually love what they see.
I love what I see. The Emmy voters love what they see, so yeah, long may she reign! Raven, real fast, I just have to know. Did you get to hold onto your crown from Snatch Game, All Stars 10, the one that just aired?
RAVEN: [laughs] I’ve been asked that. I’ve been asked that so much. No, I didn’t. I believe that was the crown for the finale. No, I didn’t. I have, um…I have an Emmy. I have so much in my life to be so grateful for that a crown, although nice to have, there’s no room for it. ‘Cause the space that I have cleared is a space for another Emmy!
Fantastic. Well, I’m hoping for Emmy part two the remix for both of you.
RAVEN: We are, too.
NATASHA: Thank you.
Thank you so much for chatting with me today.
RAVEN: Thank you.
Editor’s note: This interview has been edited for length and clarity.
“RuPaul’s Drag Race” is now available to stream on Paramount+ and more.
You can follow Cody and hear more of his thoughts on the Oscars and Film on X @codymonster91
